Episode 2: A Friend from Work: Thor Ragnarok with Brooke Robinson
Episode Overview
In this episode of Epilogues and Epiphanies, host Lyndsey McPherson and guest Brooke Robinson delve into the themes of the movie Thor: Ragnarok. They explore how humor and chaos intertwine, the importance of navigating change, the dark consequences of vengeance, and the significance of acceptance and connection in relationships. The conversation emphasizes personal growth, the journey of learning and unlearning, and the value of grace in facing life's challenges.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Thor: Ragnarok and Its Themes
05:09 The Comfort of Humor in Chaos
10:24 Navigating Change and Personal Growth
15:40 The Dark Side of Vengeance and Power
20:00 Acceptance and Connection in Relationships
25:15 The Journey of Learning and Unlearning
Transcript:
Lyndsey McPherson (00:13.688)
Hi everyone and welcome to episode two of Epilogues and Epiphanies, a show where we'll explore questions about life, the universe, and being human through the lens of TV and film. I'm your host, Lindsay McPherson, and in this week's episode, we're discussing the movie Thor, Ragnarok. This movie was directed by Taika Waititi and stars Chris Hemsworth, Cate Blanchett, Tom Hiddleston, Jeff Goldblum, and so many more. My guest this week is Brooke Robinson, and as the episode title notes,
She is a friend from work. She is also thoughtful, transparent, and kind, and somehow manages to take a discussion about superheroes and alien planets and turn it into a meaningful conversation about navigating change. So, without further ado, episode two, a friend from work.
Lyndsey McPherson (01:04.809)
So do we're still going. Hi. Hi. First off, introduce yourself. So I, you know, as an introvert, I hate this, right? Like I hate the introduction thing, but so my name is Brooke. I currently live in South Dakota, but I am originally from Ohio. I guess I don't know, like a fun fact about me, maybe, is that I.
don't think that people would think that I like Marvel movies. This is true. This is true. It sort of surprises people when they're like, wait, you, you know, all these things. I'm like, I'm not a comic book person. don't know. Yeah, same. Literally any of that. Yeah. But yeah, I people probably would never guess that I like the Marvel movies. No, I'm guessing, you know, how do we know each other? This is a question I didn't know how to answer.
actually. Yeah, so I was thinking about that. So you and I, I think originally met back in Sunday school, right? Which sounds like we were little, but no, we weren't when you were still in college. And I had just graduated. We but I would say we became friends when we worked together at the university.
Yeah, which just like happened. I feel like I was just like, yeah, I trust Brooke. We were thrown like the world's largest project. yeah. And as soon as it was over COVID hit. So yeah. lots of quick bonding experiences. Really, we've been friends for 20 years. So yeah. It feels that way in a lot of ways. It does. It's kind of crazy.
So we're talking about Thor Ragnarok, which is probably my favorite Marvel movie. Also, I know it's yours. I don't know how many times we've watched it. I couldn't give an accurate answer if someone like, you ask me how many times have you like find data on Disney Plus or something like really get a scary answer. Set the tone before we start.
Lyndsey McPherson (03:20.375)
talking about this. What's your like 30 seconds or less version of this plot? this is third, I think third Thor movie, the new one that just came out of the forest. First smack dab in the middle of the phase one of the normal Avengers world. Yeah, unveiling your nerd, right? I it. I'm not even that ashamed. in this movie, we
find out that it's not Loki that is the anomaly in the family. It's Thor, because we are introduced to a new sibling who is equally as dark and twisted as Loki and even Odin. And Thor essentially gets ricocheted through space and lands on this wild planet that's run by... Death Goldblum.
Jeff Goldblum, yeah, he's like a lovable just is Jeff Goldblum. No, you're just like, why are you here? I'm glad. What? Right, right. But so he meets up with, you know, an old friend from work in the form of the Hulk and some new friends that we meet and eventually they go back and fight the sister and, spoiler alert, things are mostly okay in the end.
The friend from work is probably be the title of this episode. Like that's the title now. Absolutely. That's where we became friends. And really that's probably the best one liner of the movie. Do you know where that line came from? Like a make a wish kid that was on the set and like suggested it and they just rolled with it and it know, right? He's got like a fast track or something. Absolutely.
finds out he has a new sister, gets ricocheted through space, meets Jeff Goldblum, teams up with a friend from work, and everything's pretty okay in the end. Mostly. What makes this movie meaningful or special to you? So it's a comfort movie for me at this point. How it got there, I don't know. But it's possible that it's just silly enough and also, I think of any of the movies in the MCU, you could
Lyndsey McPherson (05:38.957)
pulled this one out of the timeline and there's like maybe one or two moments where someone who has no idea what's going on in the universe might be like, wait, what? But other than that, this is like a perfect standalone movie. It's pretty good standalone. And it's like, it's silly and it's brightly colored and is scenes that go well with the action. yeah. That opening scene is
by far the best soundtrack of all the Marvel movies. Yeah, it's pretty good. And it's just like so rock and roll that you're like, what is going on? I think it's called Immigrant Song. So Bud Zeppelin song, apparently. You're right, though. Like, it's just you don't have to think too hard, but it is fun. It's like, I love, love, love a colorful, visually interesting movie. Yes. OK.
I mean, I know we both, we've talked about this, but I just freaking love Tycho with TT. His sense of humor is just like, it just makes me giggle. It'll like sneak up on you. It's just so like subtle. And it's not even just like the spoken jokes either that make you laugh. Like the looks or even just like the things in the background, or I have noticed that like every time I watch it, I do notice some new different thing or I pick up on.
some nuance or just some little silly thing that it does that just makes me crack up. And Taika plays... Korg! Yeah. Korg is my favorite, I think. My favorite line might be, I tried to start a revolution, but I didn't print enough pamphlets and so no one came. And it's just... Or when he says like, yeah, this is a circle, but not a normal circle. Like a freaky circle. like a freaky circle.
Yeah, just like little things like that. think comfort movies to me have to be a little funny. They can't make me think too hard and make me laugh every time. Yeah, and it's kind of like we all get to be in on the joke. we're in on the joke. Like we're in this awkward moment. Like, you know, just like these like bits that just keep going and you just like you're in the scene with them. And think that's what I like about Marvel over DC.
Lyndsey McPherson (07:59.893)
Life is not serious all the time. So I feel like movies that are so serious all the way through with no humor. I'm like, you lost me. This is not even how we're wired to exist. Like, right. Right. Well, and sometimes like if you're literally the destruction of your planet and the like end of your civilization is facing you. I don't know about you, but I'd probably be trying to find any amounts of humor anywhere in the world.
Yes, yeah. You're up against the impossible. I think maybe what I identify with or maybe what I really like or what draws me to this movie on a deeper level is how the like chaos and pain of each of the characters that comes together in the end is like sort of tangentially related but not really. And the only thing that helps them like get past that in the moment is them coming together to like serve a purpose. And so
I definitely can identify with that and maybe, I don't know if that's like a good thing or a bad thing, but you know, I know for me being able to focus on especially something that's important, task that's important or a project or a cause or something I believe in, you know, having that direction, having that focus kind of calm the chaos in my brain and my life, know? Yeah.
There's research too that when you're stressed out or you're overwhelmed and you feel stuck in kind of a almost like a stutter mode, like that's doing something can just kind of bring back that sense of agency. So there's a book, one of many, I have a lot of books on my shelf, but the one I'm thinking of in particular is
burnout, because one of the other things they talk about when you kind of have gone through something chronic, or like you're in a season of stress or anxiety is to do something, because they give anything they're like something you can see and feel like you physically accomplished, right gives you that sense of agency and control over your environment back. And I think that that makes sense, you know, rallying around, like,
Lyndsey McPherson (10:24.993)
They don't know what they're doing, you know, they're all doers pretty much. they're all coming. So I'm thinking like Korg and Meek are there, but I'm thinking the three main are, we're talking Thor and Banner and Valkyrie and they're all coming from very different places emotionally. Valkyrie and Banner are very much coming from a place of like active avoidance.
you know, she's just drinking herself to death, like admittedly drinking yourself to death. And Banner has stayed locked as the Thor or as the Hulk, I'm sorry, for two years. then when he finally comes out of it, like I think I said earlier, he's like rightfully freaked out. One, because he's on this ridiculous planet. two, because
two years of his life are just gone. You know, and it was because he was avoiding dealing with the hard emotions with Natasha and the feelings of earth hating Hulk and things like that. And then Thor is coming from this place of, like you said, this total stripping of his identity and control in his life. And they're all free up against this. What?
Honestly, seems to be like an intermountable foe. know, she's like, destroys like the whole Asgardian army or whatever in one scene, you know, and and Valkyrie references the last time Hela came around and all the other Valkyries were killed, you know, so they're facing this, this obstacle, but alone, there's no way any of them could get past.
And that's interesting. You talked about, she remembered the last time Hello was around. And so that's kind of like her past. This is her past. This is also Odin dies and we kind of have to face the truth of the past of Asgard, which is imperialism, basically. Right. Right. we, and I think like that's part of what I was referencing when I said
Lyndsey McPherson (12:48.983)
Thor is very much the odd one out in the family because we learn more about Odin's path just through what Hela has said and even a few things that Valkyrie says and you're like, baby. Maybe Odin wasn't great either. Yeah. It's like totally deconstructing his even perception of Asgard the beautiful, so to speak. was like, this is, we did bad things.
Like we built an empire. guys of protection. Yeah. You know, cause that's what Odin's job is protecting the nine realms, but really. How did we get control of the nine realms? Yeah. Right. How did we get that responsibility? Yeah. Right. I don't know. Meta, guess. Hey, that's why we're here, right? To break this down. Also, the other thing is what this rag, like she's bringing about Ragnarok and if Ragnarok is apocalypse and apocalypse means
really a revealing, she's revealing the truth of this past. And they spend a good chunk of the movie, like they're trying to prevent this, like we gotta stop it. And then they decide really what we have to do to move forward is bring it about, like let it happen and start somewhere new.
Right. And even Loki in the end, which, you know, we, is he dead? Who knows? you never, you never actually know. no, he's going to show up again. He's going to show up again for sure. Cause he always does. And Tom Hiddleston probably wants more money. So, right. They had to decide to let go of some things and like prioritize what's important. They were really clinging to this.
place and this idea and decided that it's a people, not a place. Right. And, you know, then made the decision basically to bring about a bigger monster. Right. To destroy their home for the sake of people and really the world. Cause she was, she was going to take it all back. Right. I'm like, I'm like, what does Thor teach me? I don't know what Thor teaches me.
Lyndsey McPherson (15:15.041)
that people are more important than things. Right. I think I was thinking about that too. And I was thinking for me, I feel like there's like two, if we're talking like epiphanies or takeaways that are deeper than just the funny or the whatever. I have one that's like pretty dark and one that's maybe a little sweeter. Free for all. We can edit if we need to.
We can do whatever we So because we're talking about Hela and Ragnarok itself, I'll start with the darker one. And, you know, she is very much, her actions and her motivation, and it ties in with Odin's motivation too, that we've been talking about, you know, and how the soul desires for vengeance and or power can lead to
literal destruction of civilization. We've seen it happen over and over through history and now, you know, like, in a way, she's like my least favorite villain in the MCU because everything about her is just literally about getting vengeance on Odin and what he did, even though he's now dead, she's going to take it out on everyone. You know, so like,
the power that I guess anger and yeah, vengeance, unforgiveness can wield and the destruction it can cause for even innocent people, know? And my lighter one is something that just think is very sweet about Thor that you don't notice unless you sort of pay attention and you Thor and maybe it's because he's hundreds of years old and he's
met everyone in the universe or whatever, but like, he gets dropped into this planet with like, creatures or humans or whatever from presumably every planet on in the galaxy, the universe or whatever. And he doesn't bat an eye that his new best friend slash prisoner is made of rocks. know, and he doesn't bat an eye at that. And like later on, you know, he's like the, the, the bug girl and rocket and group.
Lyndsey McPherson (17:36.665)
Right, like, he just doesn't bat an eye at that. Like, there is a, like, this acceptance or like sweetness about him. And then you see it. love, some of my favorite moments in Ragnarok are when he's trying to comfort Banner slash Hulk. Because even in the arena, he tries to like, I'm going down, I'm going down, like the thing that Natasha did to get him back to be Bruce.
you know, a, that in it cracks me up that in the middle of like fights with Ultron and his like minions, he paid attention enough to notice that like, she does this thing that calms him down. It's true. It him back to baseline, you know, but he that. But there really was like a, this is what the whole team knows and does. Yeah. Right. So he tries that and like, it's like, we see it kind of work a couple of times, but then.
the Hulk has such a hard grip on Banner that it doesn't work and he ends up just getting like tossed around. And then later when he actually is Banner again, and he's like, you know, justifiably freaking out because one, he just lost two years of his life, two, he's on a planet that I think he says is literally designed to stress me out. Yes. And, and he says,
He's like freaking out and he's like, I'm on an alien planet. And Thor's way of comforting him is to say, it's just a planet. You've been on a planet before. Yeah. And he's like, one. He's like, yeah, we're on earth. And he's like, well, now you've been on two. Like, come on, let's go. You know? It's just a place. Great. Settle down. It's not that big of a deal. You know, he misses the mark, definitely. But he tries to be really sweet in those moments. He is kind of like a puppy a little bit. Like he's got that like,
playful sense of humor. And I love that. I didn't really think about the fact that he does. He just doesn't question it. you are just whatever, whoever, whatever you are, he just is there and like, yep, okay, you're my friend. Like, or you're my person now. But yeah, no, he's kind of like a, I think that like reframing and the acceptance of Thor is he tries to
Lyndsey McPherson (20:00.257)
just be there for people. you said, he paid attention. He's hanging out with the Hulk. Like, he's having a conversation with them. Yeah, really never, no one else ever did that. You talked about his, you know, he's lost two years of his life. And that just was very interesting. Like that avoidance, you know, of
Cause that's kind of what the Hulk is. The Hulk is a defense mechanism. It's an escape. It's a protective thing. And he ran and hid so far, he lost two years, like, rather than deal with whatever was going on. And we don't ever actually get to see that with the Hulk. We get the implication that he deals with some of these things, but I think that's, know, no one really likes conflicts or
tension or thinking about hard things. But I think that when we avoid it, we definitely like, it still finds us and it still like takes things. yeah, it's time. And we're like, where did, how am I just now dealing with this? Right. It's been whatever, however long. I think that's, don't be like the Hulk. For me, it took literally, I mean, you know this, picking up and moving.
everything that I had ever known. You know, I spent 34 years in Ohio. I worked at the place I went to college. My work friends, everything was church, everybody was intertwined and I walked away from that and moved to the other side of the country and changed careers.
And got a whole different view of my role in church and just the world and the value I bring to it. I, I'm happier now than I probably have ever been for many reasons, but there are moments when I sit back and think, why did I wait so long? You know, and a lot of it was a pain avoidance thing, you know, it's
Lyndsey McPherson (22:23.789)
even when you're miserable, it can be, you know, way easier. Yeah. But I think back and you have to do it at the time that's right for you. And sometimes that time is of your own choice. And sometimes it's thrust upon you. I don't know. It just makes me think of how such like cataclysmic shifts in these characters lives, but also in our lives.
you don't realize the impact they'll have until you're in it. And I think too, the changing of your circumstances, like you chose to change your circumstance in this movie, a couple of them were just thrown out somewhere. Right. And what you choose to do with that, and we've talked about that, is sometimes life
And sometimes even if you choose it, it's still hard, but it's deciding what to do with where you are. And, you talked a little bit about timing. It can be one of those things where when you're stuck and you get unstuck, whether that's in a situation, in a mindset, in a episode of depression or something, and you finally get the motivation to do whatever it is you need to do, it can be really easy to get restuck in.
this like guilt circle of why didn't I do this earlier? you know, and like, should yourself, right? That's just wasted energy. Like be proud of yourself that you did it. Like be proud of yourself that today you got up and you did something. Whereas yesterday, like you didn't, you stayed on the couch. Like, you found the motivation to call a friend today. Like you went to church today.
when it was scary or you said yes to a coffee date because you needed to branch out and make some new friends, even though it was scary. whatever the thing is, like don't be, you can be mad about how you should have gotten there sooner or you can just like embrace it and roll with it. And I think
Lyndsey McPherson (24:47.573)
I think that's something, you we talked about these characters and how they're all handling different situations and, you know, some of them charge at things too hard and some of them like run away from things. And like, think we all end up where we need to be when we need to be there. And to just have grace and acceptance for ourselves and for other people, wherever they're at in that process is huge.
It's hard. Change is hard. mean, I, change is happening. but also I think there's two parts of that and it's taking the agency that you have for yourself to do what you can do. But also knowing that some of those choices are to choose to connect with other people because you need other people along the way. and the story doesn't really get solved until everyone decides we're like.
pursuing the same cause and like in this thing together. And I think it can be easy. Like you're in the moment, you have this action, you know, for them, it's the very tangible action of, of preventing or bringing on to, to, you know, the same, the, the people of Asgard, you know, with Ragnarok. But then the second part of that is you have to come to terms.
with the things you were avoiding before the event that got you out of where you were. And in some ways that's harder. know, like it's like change is scary, physical change, job change, relationship change, whatever it is, it's scary. But if you've been in in a not great spot that you've been avoiding,
you know, to save face or to, you know, protect a relationship or... To survive sometimes. Yeah, yeah. Then once you get on the other side of it, you have to be like, yeah, that was messed up, you know, or yeah, I'm gonna have to find a way to move on, you know, and... It's like you have to have to unlearn the adapting strategies that you had.
Lyndsey McPherson (27:08.513)
before, right? It's, kind of like on a smaller scale, but similar to, you know, the ways we learned to operate within our families of origin were how we had to as kids, like messages we learned about, this is how I survive or thrive in this environment. But most of the time they're pretty maladaptive when we get to adulthood, right? Like that doesn't really serve us anymore. It's not sustainable. Right.
you have to wade back through it or it'll come back up. I think, I mean, that's, that's what this whole thing was. Odin just kind of stuck her in a box and didn't deal with it. And now, now his kids get to deal with it and it's the end of the planet. And it's, and I think it is like a learning experience because you'll, you'll never like get to the end of your list. I've solved all my issues. I'm good now.
And I, you know, I work in child protection and I have a lot of teenagers on my caseload and many of them are in facilities where they have structured therapy and you know, they're like, I have to kind of make them step back sometimes because they're like, okay, I did my, I did my trauma timeline and now I'm learning my coping skills and I talked about my past and now I know what I want to do next. Like, so can I be done?
I did all the things I'm supposed to do. Can I, can I get out of here? have to remind them that like the point of this, where you just were was to teach you how to start dealing with the thing. It doesn't mean you dealt with the thing, you know, maybe you dealt with some of it, but when you're 30 years old and have kids of your own, what happened with your parents may come back in a title way.
You know, grief is not linear and, and trauma therapy, you know, it's, it comes and goes and twists and turns. And, know, like you said, it, it's not about necessarily like the end point. Yeah. It's, it's learning how to get better at it. I used to think that the point of life is to learn how to not fall down.
Lyndsey McPherson (29:34.771)
No, definitely not. You will fail. No life is you will fall down. Get good at getting back up, right? Get really good at those reflex muscles of starting over and dusting yourself off quicker and like not to rush yourself, but like just to build that strength to believe that it's not the end of the world because I fell down. Right. And unlearning what got you there, whether it was your fault or as a result of someone else's action. Yeah.
I didn't realize that I could, that Thor Ragnarok could get us, you know, get us here, but. We got there. We got there. That's like why I'm doing this is this is what my brain does all the time. My brain will find the thing to learn and grow from, for better or worse, it will find it in everything. And I think to some extent that entertainment and
life can be more meaningful if you can look for the truth in all things. Cause I think it's there. And I think we would have a more accepting culture if we did. If we were like, if you're paying attention and you're learning from what you're seeing and hearing and seeing the stories as stories of real people. Right. Right.
And the value that each person, each story, even each trial or, or problem you have, you know, having to learn. know for me, like in those moments, when you want to rush through it again, which is an avoidance thing, when you kind of take a step back and go, okay, this is helping me in, in whatever way.
I'm learning from it in maybe I don't get why, maybe I don't get how right now, but I need to focus on, or at least I need to be aware of how I'm feeling and what's going on. And I think that is kind of that being present and learning and seeing the value, which is hard, but it is important. Yeah, absolutely.
Lyndsey McPherson (31:58.189)
That was a lot. mean, definitely. It was a lot. was a lot. That was good. Thank you for being a guest. Absolutely. Thanks for having me. appreciate it. This was fun. I would like to keep talking to you, but without replying. If that's cool. Let's do it.
Thank you guys so much for joining me again for episode 2 of Epilogues and Epiphanies. I hope that you learned something or maybe thought a new thought. I also hope that you'll take some time this week to ask yourself what you've been avoiding dealing with and be brave enough to start finding ways to engage it. Whether that's physical health, mental health, a relationship issue, whatever it might be. I hope that you find grace for yourself.
not get stuck in the shame of what you should have done already or what you should be better at and just let yourself take the next right step. And as always, hold some grace for others trying to do the same. Thanks so much for joining me again. I hope you have a great week.
